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Okay, let me see, make sure we're going. All right, cool. Oops. All right. So today's date is - Today's date is June 17th, 2022. We are on Virginia Avenue, near an organization called Miriam's Kitchen. My name is Reginald Black, and I'm here with - C Money the Greatest. And I do have your permission to record this interview right? All right. So you're going to have to repeat your full name.

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C Money the Greatest. And add to that, where and when were you born? Where? Yeah. Where were you born?

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Washington, DC. 1963. Born and raised here? All my life. So have you experienced homelessness?

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Yes, for 14 years. Since I divorced my wife in 2008. And how would you describe where you live now? What do you mean by that? Like, your current living situation, are you still homeless?

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I have an apartment in DC. Okay. Why do you think homelessness continues to be a big problem in Washington DC and in the DMV? Homelessness is always going to be a problem because Jesus was homeless and people before him were homeless. So it's always going to be a problem. The only problem is - Homelessness is really not a problem. It's that people make it a problem. People don't want to see people sitting on the street or living on the street or hanging on the street. I mean, they act like it's just their town but it's not, it's all of our town. It's for everybody, for the people. So people can do they want as long as they don't break any rules and regulations. You know what I'm saying?

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Yeah, I do know what you're saying. Do you think people have the ability to live in this area? Has that changed since you've been living here? What do you mean by that? Do you think today people are out on the street more or less than, let's say - What do you mean by that?

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More or less [than] when you were 20 or something, do you think there was more homeless people now or then? You say when I was 20, which was almost 30 years ago, something like that. Maybe 40. There weren't that many people in the world so the world has changed. So the people have changed. So the world has gotten bigger and larger, so there's more people on this planet now. They don't have the resources to supply the needs for all these people. That's why they're homeless. In terms of those resources, what kinds of resources are available to you? You're talking about me or the people?

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To you, the people. Are there jobs available? Do people do those jobs pay enough for people to live? What kind of job are you talking about? Because they have jobs, like you said, they have a lot of jobs available but they don't have jobs that are paying a living wage where you can survive in this town. They're really paying under the scale. I mean, $15 is not enough. A person that makes least $200 a day. Just two hundred dollars after taxes a day in this town. You can't survive. You can't make it. I'm going to say $300. You can't be making less than $300 a day. To survive in this - Washington, DC? Yeah. And that would be probably why it's like - Why people will be like, there's not enough jobs or job.

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No, there still is a lot of jobs out there, but the job is not paying for the living expenses. If you make $10 or $15 an hour, right? You're working 8 hours a day, 40 hours a week. Your rent is going to be like fifteen to two thousand dollars, or maybe fifteen to twenty - Fifteen hundred to twenty - Twenty-five hundred a month. That's only your rent. Plus on top of that, you need to have a car. If you have a car that's gonna be another $500. Then you have a cell phone, you got your cable, you're talking about - You come into at least $4,000 a month just in bills. Just in bills alone. Yeah, I see. Do you think the government services or changes to those services impact homelessness? Have they made it better or worse? Well, the government services are a 50-50 win for the government. Because fifty winning and fifty they're losing. So they don't care because this is - it's the people's money they're spending anyway. It's government money, so they don't care. They win either way, it's just the people that are losing, not really. It's how you - It's up to one individual. You need to take advantage of the situation that they give you, just roll with that. Each - Because each person is different. Each case is different. That's all I can say. Yeah, each case is different.

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You ever have any experience with public housing? What do you mean by that? Say, spots like, uhh, say, Langston Lane or Benning Heights. But what do you mean by that? What do you mean? What do you mean, "experienced" it? Have I been around there? Lived in there? What do you mean? I know people who lived there. I've been in those areas, yeah.

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What do you - Have you ever stayed in any of the shelters and if so, what do you think the state of those shelters are, do they have any impact on - The state of the shelters are, you don't want to go to the shelter because they're worse than prison. I'd rather go to jail than go to the shelters because at least in prison, you're somewhat protected. In the shelters, you're not protected at all. It's just a free-for-all in the shelters. They frisk you down in there, find out you don't have any weapons or not, he let you in, but, you know, people still sneak stuff in the shelters and they get to know these guards. The guards aren't doing their jobs all the time. You go in, come out, go in, come out. People come in for - Coming in and out three or four times a night, so you don't know what they're bringing in, what they're taking out. Like I said, I'd rather be in jail than the shelter, I'll sleep outside. So you're saying that prisons have a better impact on homelessness?

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No, I didn't say that. They have a better structure, as far as housing people, keeping people off the street. Yeah. Wow. And, like, that - That's a form of housing or - It's an inter - what is it called? Institutional housing. Does it affect poverty?

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What's affect poverty? So if you - Say you sell jewelry but you don't have a vendor's license and they lock you up for that. Is that something that perpetrates homelessness, or how does the criminalization of poverty play into that? Because you were saying, jails are this form of institutionalized housing. So the way people get locked up. Is that something that is good for them? Or is it making it worse? Well, that depends on what they're getting locked up for. What's the crime they committed or accused of being committed? Jail is a good thing and a bad thing. It all depends on the individual with the crime they committed. So another thing too, people ask questions about how does homelessness affect a person's health?

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What do you mean by that? Does it give you more conditions, does it make you stronger? Does it make you weaker? Do you suffer from it? All that I'm going say about my - I can't speak for anybody but I can speak for myself. Since I've been on - Since I've been homeless for 14 years, I'm much stronger, faster, sharper. My body is where it needs to be at this age of 59. I'm still playing basketball at 59. I'm in the greatest shape I've ever been in. My mind is right, my body, right. Everything is right for me, being homeless. Wow, that's amazing. What about education, quality of education? How does that impact homelessness?

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Education is what you want - What you want to learn. It's up to you, it's up to the individual to want to learn, what they want want to know. If you want to know something, they have the libraries, they got these book - little spots where the books at. Get your book and read. They got all different - They have the internet, they have YouTube. Everything is there. It's just on they individual, they just have to want it. I see. So you're saying that there are access to skills and training and those are things are available to people. You can train yourself to do whatever you want to be. It's up to the individual, and the tools are there, they just got to go get it. The resources are there. We've gone through some of the things that make up homelessness and some of the things that people could do. But are there groups or strategies that people are doing to try to end homelessness that you know of?

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What you mean by that? Are there groups or strategies people are doing to try to end homelessness? What do you mean by that? People - I don't think people know everything that is going on in DC to end homelessness.

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Homelessness has been around since man's been around. So I don't know what you're talking about. Hmm. Well - Man created homelessness. That's an interesting viewpoint, that man created homelessness. That's kind of like - How did man create homelessness? I've heard people say that but I don't understand it.

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Because man doesn't want any responsibility. So he decided he wanted to go homelessness. You don't want to live up to your responsibilities, run away from it, then you become homeless. Have you ever heard of any movements or groups that are - The word there is mobilizing - But that making progress in ending homelessness? I mean, making progress? You can never end homelessness because as long as humans are around, there's going to be homelessness. All a man needs to do is say, he doesnt want his house and he can be homeless. I mean, if somebody doesn't want a house or doesn't want to work or anything against the system, they're homeless, or whatever. Homelessness is a state of mind anyway. If there was movement to end homelessness, they should focus on mindsets first? How would a movement to end homelessness start? What would that look like?

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I don't understand the question you're trying to say. If there was a way to get the attention of hundreds of people, including folks who are currently homeless, to band together to end it, where should we start? Get rid of all the Europeans. And the foreigners. That'll free up a lot of money, so everybody else that is on this earth and this planet that's citizens and belong here, we get that due share. So you're saying that there isn't enough money and that's -

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I did not say that. You said that. Well, could you share what you mean? Share what? I didn't say what you said. You said that. So tell them what I said - I said you get rid of Europeans and these foreigners, and let these people that were born in this country and born this city and stay right here, whatever you want to call it, this federal land, get that resident, what would you call that? Residency benefit packages, whatever they call a gift for being a ward of this city. Then yeah. If everybody gets their 40 acres and a mule that was born here, then we'd be all right. If everybody that was born here -

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Born in this city, in this state, got a 578 or 579 social security card, give them what their due process is. And what would be that due process? Their 40 acres and a mule. What he says in the Constitution. It does say in the Constitution that folks are entitled to 40 acres and a mule. But like that's language -

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That's what - Lincoln freed the slaves for that. That's what - We fought for that, our forefathers. So ,your 40 acres and a mule will be what? A house? I don't even want that., I don't even want that. I just want to be left alone. Let me do what I need to do. Hmm. Because I know I'm not going to get that from the Europeans or the establishment. I need to do what I need to do to survive. I see. Are there - Are things that I may have missed to ask?

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Like what? Are there question I may have missed to ask? I mean, I don't know, you probably would have a better understanding of that. What do you really want to know? It's more so about getting at the ideas around how to get more people interested in ways to -

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I told you what to do. You have to get out downtown and go in the hood where the people are. The people aren't downtown. In Ward 7 and Ward 8, that's where the people are. Ward 7 and Ward 8. East of the river. There's a whole of of people there. So, okay, if people did go to east of the river, what needs to be done there? What needs to be done? Yeah. Like, what do you see needs to be done? What does Ward 7 and 8 need help with?

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First they need the - The whole structure needs to be - Like they're doing downtown, they need to do the same thing in Ward 7, Ward 8. Are you saying infrastructure, buildings, roads? Yeah. Build, clean, and remove. What needs to be removed?

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All the shit that's not - That's falling down or [unintelligible]. Old churches, old schools, old houses, get rid of them, bring new ones in. New structures, new property, new infrastructures. And so that would give the people the jobs and all those things that they need. That will get people - If you fix up their community, they will take care of the community. Get the people what they want and then they will take care of it. If you build it, they will come. You know what I'm saying? If you build it, they will come. That's a - What movie is that? Field of Dreams?

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Yeah, that's what they say. If you build it, they will come. Okay, okay. If someone were to build something that would make you go to it, what would that be? Make me go to it? Yeah, you said if you build it, they would come.

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If we had a 24-hour community center in every ward or every jurisdiction, that would be good. A 24-hour community center. So it would like serve you, seniors - Serve the community, everybody. It's for everybody who wants to use the facilities in that area. What would you like to see in that center? Would they have a gym, a pool?

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Everything you want for the community. Showers, weights, gym, pool, basketball court, stuff for the seniors, computer lab, little play for the kids, for the children, ten-and-unders. For the teams, got something for the teams and the seniors. For everybody. I think these would be some great ideas that people - They had them in the eighties when I was going up, I don't know why they don't have them now. All the rec centers had them until they closed them all down. Really?

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Yeah. Where I grew up, I grew up in Southeast, we had a swimming pool, basketball court, tennis court, all of that. Computers. Was it free for you to use? It's a recreation center, it was free for everyone who came to the rec. Just sign your name on the sign-in sheet and put down what you want to use or do that day. If you want to play basketball, tennis, go swimming. It was like a checklist. And you think having those all around the city would help people have better lives?

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Yeah. You'd have a better community than what you're having now. So that's probably what feeds into people being just willy-nilly, just out there. They don't have stuff to do. They don't have things to refocus their minds. I don't know if I got that right. But is that what you were saying? You can lead a horse to the water but he's not going to drink it. These people have everything - People - I don't know. These people need to be reprogrammed or just, they're looking for leaders, somebody to tell them what to do. These grown men, women, and children, they're looking for somebody to tell them what to do. It's all right there in the book of where you went to school at, your mother and father, whoever taught you when you were growing up between right and wrong, they should already know. I can't teach - Teaching the same thing over and over to the same person and then he's 70 years old, he's still doing the same thing. "You can't do that, you can't -" Sooner or later, you have to learn.

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You're saying there also has to be some forms of adaptation. People have to move with the times. If there's a new technology out, they should be going places to learn that and the city should - I'm not saying they should. But if you want to keep up with what's going on, you need to broaden your horizon. You know, if you want to be a dinosaur, be a dinosaur, standing down and sort of lame. But if you want to be - keep up with the Joneses, you have to do everything the Jonses are doing, you know I'm saying? Hmm, everything the Joneses are doing. What does that mean? Google it and find out. [laughs] Yeah, just like all the [unclear] and words you use. What's that mean?

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I can tell you what they mean. Me too. But you're smart enough, you should know what it means. What word do you want me to use, what word do you want me to define? Use whatever you've been using. This is your interview! I'm just asking questions, man. Well, are there any other things that you think should be discussed?

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I'm just asking questions, man. Well, are there any other things that you think should be discussed? think that the bottom line is, with this homeless thing, it's all - It's not about the people being homeless, it's about that money and it's always been about the money. Never been about the homeless person. It's always been what they can get from that homeless person, the money can generate from that person. This is like a prisoner. When a person gets locked up, that's $150,000 a year to house that prisoner, at least $150,000 a year just to house that one prisoner. Yeah, so that's just for a prison. Just think a homeless person, how it costs to house the homeless person. I don't know. More than 10 times as much to house a prisoner.

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Yeah. So we're just wasting money. Yeah. Wasting a whole lot of money. Whole lot of money. That's why they'll never end homelessness, because a lot of money be wasted. [sarcastic laugh] And they don't even care. Look, we started this homeless thing in 2008, right? 2008, it was a bunch of us, like five guys and we used to have Miriam's Kitchen. And one of the directors came to me, asked me, "how would you like to start your own group? And I said, yeah, that'd be good. He said, "you can meet down here once a week, blah-blah-blah." So I said okay, I told the people, we're talking. And they say yeah. So we started meeting down at the Kitchen once a week. So that was in 2008. Since then, I mean, now it's 2022. We were just one group. Just trying to get out of that homelessness situation. Now we have 1000 agencies doing the work that we started doing and what we discussed about getting out of the homeless situation. So we've been doing that for 14 years, but the outside world, I don't know how long they've been doing it, but since we've been doing it, we put that feather in the cap. They made billions and billions of dollars off of us. Off our ideas, off our likeness and all that. And we didn't get anything. I mean, we might get a little pat on the back or something, but that's not anything compared to what they got, you know what I'm saying? What the outsiders got from us laying this front down, standing up for ourselves and, you know, demanding this and demanding that.

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People for Fairness isn't fair. People for Fairness - People for Fairness Coalition. What's that?

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That's what we named it. People for Fairness Coalition. It's just a name, became a way to - Because we're the people for fairness. We're fair people, and we had a coalition. We have a coalition for brothers and sisters, getting together, airing out our differences, and coming to the table and see what we can do about trying to fix each other's problems. Doing the coalition. And is this group still around, or - Oh yeah. They've been around - This is our 14th year now. Going on 15 years. Okay. And you're saying that it was created out of people who were actually homeless? It was you, it was -

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It was like five or six, seven of us, we were homeless and we were going down to Miriam's Kitchen, complaining about this, complaining about they're feeding us, telling us what to do and all that bullcrap. Basically, we didn't really have any rights or anything, we couldn't say what we wanted to do. It's just like we had the plague or something. So we started our own group, an organization. That's how I got started. We got rights, we know we're human beings like they're human beings. Sounds like if there was a movement to end homelessness, it sounds like People for Fairness Coalition would be - We're the founders of all the homelessness in this area, the DMV. We're the originals, we're the ones where they got all the money from, all the ideas from, and all that. They got it all from us, People for Fairnesss Coalition. Then there was [unclear] group and Face and Hope DC and some other groups came along the way while we - yeah. Our DC or something like that, and some other. Sharp. Philosophy. Who else? Hope DC. What was the other Face? Yeah, I mean, yeah. Then they came through, they followed through on what we were doing but they just piggybacked on what we were doing. But we're the originals. We we started all that. We started all that. People for Fairness Coalition.

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Well, thank you man, my buddy. It's all good man. Nice doing interview with y'all. Good luck on y'all ending homelessness. I don't think it'll ever end, as long as we're going to have these people on the planet. [laughs] It will only end when the the last man is gone. That's when it will end. When there's no more humans. Just humanoids, or - what do you call it? Cyborgs.